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Re: Steam boiler replacement and hot water unit

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Posted by HeatPro on December 02, 2007 at 15:10:34:

In Reply to: Re: Steam boiler replacement and hot water unit posted by steve on November 30, 2007 at 04:12:47:

: ++++ I thought you need the feeder make-up system to compensate for the smaller volume of water in a new boiler.
-- No, all that will do is overfill the system to make problems.
How can one get around the need for the larger volume of water?
-- You need to provide the water to fill the steam radiation and piping on every demand for heat. You do that by adding the vessel to do that.

: ++++ Are you saying one can keep the radiators and switch to hot water?
-- provided the radiators have top manifolds built in, yes.

: : ++ A new steam boiler will be about 85% AFUE no matter which. 1920 boilers were in the 40
: : % AFUE range.
: ++++ I don't have it in front of me by the service folks usually got AFUE readings in the 70s on the old boiler.
-- That gives an idea of what you can save in fuel.
insulation is the big savings factor as it can cut the heat need to 1/3rd of an uninsulated house or more.
: ++++ Either way, with steam the insulation doesn't really gain one that much.
-- So you are saying that cutting the heat output of the house produces no savings, which is defying the law of physics and the reason new homes are well-insulated.
: :
: ++++ Isn't gas generally more expensive, particularly on a steam system?
-- More expensive than what, where and when. If gas was more expensive, it wouldn't have been used so oil heat shrunk from 60% of the market to 6% in 50 years.

Do you know of tank liners for residential tanks?
++It would be too expensive to retrofit old tanks. New tanks come with a liner.

The options I see online seem commercial oriented.
--Aren't they all? Why else advertise?

: : .
: ++++ The contractor has explained very little about the boiler, generally saying the heating sub contractor was there and recommended the system.
-- It would cost him as much in business time educating you to all he intends and has to do than to just do it. Bug him with questions until he can't afford to be around waiting for a contract signing. You would be insulting him with a question of 'Tell me all you've learned in your lifetime in five minutes." There really are reasons people are called 'professionals.'

: How do the on-demand water heaters compare with some sort of indirect system using the steam boiler. The old boiler had an indirect that was later replaced with a hot water tank.
--The comparisons are manifestos in publications. Search for all that in Google.

: How expensive (ballpark) is switching to gas at a later date by using the power burner? Would it be better to start out with a power burner if this is a possible direction?
-- This requires actual studies of your existing system in comparison with the new proposed one. As nobody knows what the system will be; all is a guess.

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Comments:
: : ++++ I thought you need the feeder make-up system to compensate for the smaller volume of water in a new boiler. : -- No, all that will do is overfill the system to make problems. : How can one get around the need for the larger volume of water? : -- You need to provide the water to fill the steam radiation and piping on every demand for heat. You do that by adding the vessel to do that. : : ++++ Are you saying one can keep the radiators and switch to hot water? : -- provided the radiators have top manifolds built in, yes. : : : ++ A new steam boiler will be about 85% AFUE no matter which. 1920 boilers were in the 40 : : : % AFUE range. : : ++++ I don't have it in front of me by the service folks usually got AFUE readings in the 70s on the old boiler. : -- That gives an idea of what you can save in fuel. : insulation is the big savings factor as it can cut the heat need to 1/3rd of an uninsulated house or more. : : ++++ Either way, with steam the insulation doesn't really gain one that much. : -- So you are saying that cutting the heat output of the house produces no savings, which is defying the law of physics and the reason new homes are well-insulated. : : : : : ++++ Isn't gas generally more expensive, particularly on a steam system? : -- More expensive than what, where and when. If gas was more expensive, it wouldn't have been used so oil heat shrunk from 60% of the market to 6% in 50 years. : Do you know of tank liners for residential tanks? : ++It would be too expensive to retrofit old tanks. New tanks come with a liner. : The options I see online seem commercial oriented. : --Aren't they all? Why else advertise? : : : . : : ++++ The contractor has explained very little about the boiler, generally saying the heating sub contractor was there and recommended the system. : -- It would cost him as much in business time educating you to all he intends and has to do than to just do it. Bug him with questions until he can't afford to be around waiting for a contract signing. You would be insulting him with a question of 'Tell me all you've learned in your lifetime in five minutes." There really are reasons people are called 'professionals.' : : How do the on-demand water heaters compare with some sort of indirect system using the steam boiler. The old boiler had an indirect that was later replaced with a hot water tank. : --The comparisons are manifestos in publications. Search for all that in Google. : : How expensive (ballpark) is switching to gas at a later date by using the power burner? Would it be better to start out with a power burner if this is a possible direction? : -- This requires actual studies of your existing system in comparison with the new proposed one. As nobody knows what the system will be; all is a guess.

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